Spiritual
versus “natural”
An OAC member wrote:
“...John 4v24…God is SPIRIT and does who serve Him
must serve Him in Spirit and in Truth.What do I want to tell you through this
vers? I want to make know unto you that you interpret the Scriptures NATURALLY
and exactly as it is written in the Bible.When God speaks to His people…he
speaks in a language that only they will understand-SPIRITUAL.Seeing that they
have His Spirit ,they are able to understand Him...” Sic
OAC members love
quoting John
4:24 but they have more faith in the spoken words of the physical
person whom they know as their “owergestelde”. When the Spirit of
God is in us then He speaks with us through His Spirit (John 14:17, 1 Corinthians 3:16).
Now let us
read John
4:24 in context with the other verses before it:
John 4:20-24 Our
fathers worshipped in this mountain; and ye say, that in Jerusalem is
the place where men ought to worship. Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe
me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at
Jerusalem, worship the Father. Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we
worship: for salvation is of the Jews. But the hour cometh, and now is, when the
true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the
Father seeketh such to worship him. God is a Spirit: and they that worship him
must worship him in spirit and in truth.
From the
context it is clear that because God is a Spirit, He is not limited
geographically, He can be worshipped wherever the true worshippers may find
themselves geographically. It has absolutely nothing to do with literal interpretation
of the Scriptures. Jesus was speaking to a
Samaritan woman (John 4:9). The major issue between Jews and Samaritans has
always been the location of the Chosen Place to worship God; Mount Zion in
Jerusalem according to the Jewish faith or Mount Gerizim according to the
Samaritan faith (Ezra and the Law in History and Tradition).
It’s all
about perspective, in Hebrew the words for “matter” (chômer - חֹמֶר) and “spirit” (rûach
- רוּחַ) are interchangeable. The letters that spell chômer also spell rûach,
all you have to do is drop the letter mem
(מֶ). The difference between the
spiritual and material world is a matter of perspective.
If you look
at the world in one way, you see a material world.
“We are the product of primordial quantum fluctuations” –
Excerpt from ‘The Origin of (almost) Everything’ by Prof. Stephen Hawking
If you
change the quality of your perception and look at things in a new and fresh
way, then the very same world becomes spiritual. It’s the same world but it’s
the quality of your relationship with the material world which makes it
spiritual.
“A point worth noting is that the universe, nature, is itself a
communication to us from G-d. The vastness, the boundless variety, the sense of
structure and the sense of a constant interplay of dynamic forces express
something about G-d, who causes every detail in the universe to exist. A
painting in an art gallery tells us something about the painter; existence
tells us something about G-d.” – Excerpt from ‘Nature as Divine
Communication’ by Dr. Tali Loewenthal
As a child
we sang the following hymn at primary school:
Refrain:
All things bright and
beautiful,
All creatures great and
small,
All things wise and
wonderful:
The Lord God made them
all.
Each little flow’r that
opens,
Each little bird that
sings,
He made their glowing
colors,
He made their tiny wings.
The purple-headed
mountains,
The river running by,
The sunset and the morning
That brightens up the sky.
The cold wind in the
winter,
The pleasant summer sun,
The ripe fruits in the
garden,
He made them every one.
The tall trees in the
greenwood,
The meadows where we play,
The rushes by the water,
To gather every day.
He gave us eyes to see
them,
And lips that we might
tell
How great is God Almighty,
Who has made all things
well.
As a child
this hymn didn’t make me more “carnally
minded” by understanding creation “naturally”. Since the creation of the world
His invisible nature and attributes, His eternal power and divinity, have been
made intelligible and clearly discernible in and through the things that have
been made (Romans
1:20).
There is a
common view in the OAC that the
opposite of “spiritual” is “natural”. We are literally sown as “natural” bodies
and after we die, our bodies will literally return to dust (1 Corinthians
15:44-49).
An OAC member wrote:
“...I'am sorry it's either natural or spiritual! I
am reading fruit salad! Mengelmoes sou jy natuur en gees mix!
Lol
it's either naturally or spiritually! You cannot mix the two then you have
fruidsalad!
God
demands that we choose one way or the other—but not straddle the fence. We
cannot have it both ways. Unless in the battle between the spirit and the flesh
we throw down the gauntlet in favor of our spiritual selves, we run the risk of
being torn to pieces psychologically and emotionally.
Recall
Psalm 119:113: "I hate the double-minded, but I love Your law."
Notice that the antidote to double-mindedness is yielding to God's law.
Wholeness and singleness of purpose are the result of keeping God's law through
the power of Christ working in us. As our Lord reminds us in His Sermon on the
Mount, "The lamp of the body is the eye. If therefore your eye is good
[single, KJV; focused, directed], your whole body will be full of light"
(Matthew 6:22)...”
Another OAC member
responded: “...Indeed, beloved [name deleted] we cannot be lukewarm in
the mouth of God it's either we are cold or hot. But when we are lukewarm he'll
spew us out of his mouth.
None
can serve two masters at once : flesh and Spirit
We
should lay upon our treasures in heaven/spiritual realm not upon earth/natural
things where moth and thieves can break in and steal our treasure.
Jesus
is you and Christ is the born again soul that gives life to the world through
the testimony...”
Unless you
know your Bible, such utter rubbish as the OAC member comments
above may confuse you. Go and read those verses being quoted in your Bible and
you’ll see how single verses are being misquoted and twisted out of context.
According to
the Bible it is the flesh (carnal)
which is the opposite of the Spirit.
Romans 8:5-7 For
they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh;
but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit. For
to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law
of God, neither indeed can be.
Galatians 5:16 This I
say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit
against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that
ye cannot do the things that ye would.
Literal
interpretation of the Bible is not
walking in the flesh or being carnally minded by any stretch of the imagination
(Matthew
22:29, Mark 12:24, Acts 17:10-12, Romans 15:4,
2 Timothy
3:15-17).
Walking in
the flesh refers to adultery, fornication, uncleanness, covetousness,
filthiness, lasciviousness, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations,
greediness, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, envyings, murders, drunkenness,
revellings and such like (Matthew 15:18-20, Mark 7:20-23, Romans 1:25-32,
1
Corinthians 5:9-11, 1 Corinthians 6:9-10, 1 Corinthians 6:15-20, Galatians
5:19-21, Ephesians 4:17-31, Ephesians 5:3-7, Colossians 3:5-9,
1
Thessalonians 4:3-8, Hebrews 13:4-5, 2 Peter 2:4-10, Revelation 21:8,
Revelation
22:15). It is the fleshly
lusts (carnal mindedness) which war against the soul (1 Peter 2:11), not literal
interpretations of the Bible.
A verse that
OAC members love
quoting out of context is that the “letter killeth,
but the Spirit giveth life”. By this they try to imply that reading the
Bible is fatal to the soul and that “breaking bread” on each verse and “spiritualising” it gives it life. Let’s read
that verse in context and see what it really means.
2 Corinthians 3:3-7 Forasmuch
as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us,
written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables
of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart. And such trust have we through
Christ to God-ward: Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing
as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God; Who also hath made us able
ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the
letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life. But if the ministration of
death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children
of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his
countenance; which glory was to be done away:
The letter
that kills is the Mosaic law chiselled in stone because it was a literal death sentence
to the sinner who broke the law (Leviticus 20:10-21, Deuteronomy 22:22-27, John 8:4-12).
The words that Jesus spoke are spirit and
life and they are written in the Bible (John 6:63).
Another
verse that OAC members love to
quote to explain why they don’t read the Bible as it’s written is Jude 1:10.
When this verse is read in context, it mentions nothing about reading the Bible
any differently to how it’s written.
Jude 1:7-11 Even as
Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving
themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set
forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire. Likewise also these
filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak
evil of dignities. Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the
devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a
railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee. But these speak evil of
those things which they know not:
but
what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they
corrupt themselves. Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain,
and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished
in the gainsaying of Core.
Those giving
themselves over to fornication are filthy dreamers that defile the flesh
because of what they know naturally as brute beasts. What they know is like
animal instinct instead of rational knowledge and without rational thought.
They speak evil of those things they know not and what they know not is the
Word of God. Instead their pride lies in their so-called special knowledge.
A true and practical
example: My “priest” did not interpret
the Bible “naturally” but he had an affair with an unmarried young-member
sister and made her pregnant. Understanding the whole Bible as an allegory did
not make him spiritual; he still followed his fleshly lusts to commit adultery.
According to the Bible we can safely say my “priest” was carnally
minded.
The fruit of
the Spirit is not a parable. It is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness,
goodness, faith, meekness and temperance. They that are Christ's have crucified the
flesh with the affections and lusts (Galatians 5:22-25, Ephesians 5:8-11, 2 Peter 1:4-8).
Trying to understand “mysteries” to become “spiritually minded” is highly exaggerated
(1
Corinthians 13:1-3).
 |
| Understanding this literally will not harm your soul |
An OAC member berated
another OAC member’s literal
interpretation of the Bible as follows: “...To
interpret and to believe the bible is spiritually is one of the main things
that seperates Old Apostolics from the rest of the world and other churches..
So now we can sommer join the NG kerk because you believe everything in the
bible is natural happenings that happened 2000+ years ago.. My brother, you
must go to you’re underdeacon so that he can explain all these things to you so
that God can take out your heart of stone, and give you a fleshy heart so that
He can write His word on your heart...”
Another OAC member wrote:
“...what today makes the Old Apostolic Church
Gnostic? To answer that we have to look at what they belief in...”
Gnosticism
believes matter is the opposite of spirit; therefore matter is evil because
spirit is good. As a result, Gnostics believe that anything you do in your body
irrespective of any sin you commit has no meaning because real life exists only
in spirit. This belief reflects the behaviour of the “priest” I mentioned earlier. Compare this view
with what’s written in your Bible (Romans 6:12, Romans 13:13-14, 2 Corinthians 4:11,
Galatians
5:16-24, Ephesians 2:1-3, James 1:12-16, 1 Peter 2:11-12,
1 Peter 4:1-6).
Gnostics
claim to possess “elevated” knowledge (gnosis) known only
to their inner circle. This knowledge is not from the Bible but acquired from
some or other mystical higher plane of existence. Gnostics believe this makes
them privileged and elevated above everyone else because they claim to have a deeper knowledge of God. Gnostics believe
salvation is gained by acquiring some kind of divine knowledge. This is not what the
Bible teaches. The salvation that Christ offers is a free gift
from God and available to everyone who believes in Jesus (John 3:16, John 14:6, Ephesians 2:8-9). Salvation is
not only available to a select few with some secret knowledge.
Gnostics
don’t believe Jesus physically existed, but only
seemed to be physical and that His spirit descended at baptism and left Him
before He was crucified. The Bible however affirms His complete humanity and
His full deity (Luke
24:39-40, John 20:24-29, Acts 1:2-3, Romans 5:15, 1 Corinthians
15:12-19, 1 Timothy 2:5, Hebrews 2:9).
Gnostics twist verses out of context to harmonize
with their philosophy; the Bible is superseded by
their thoughts, ideas, writings and visions. The Bible has
clear warnings against this (Deuteronomy 4:2, Deuteronomy 12:32, Proverbs 30:5-6,
Matthew
5:17-20, Revelation 22:18-19). All scripture is given
by inspiration of God (2 Timothy 3:15-17).
Gnosticism
questions God and the words He spoke. Gnosticism calls God and the Bible into
question and those who are naïve or scripturally uninformed are easily caught in its web. Gnosticism
also appeals to those who are seeking some kind of personal revelation to
make them feel unique, special or superior to others.
Gnosticism
is clearly unbiblical. Is the OAC Gnostic? Examine
your beliefs and compare them to what’s written in the Bible. If the shoe fits,
wear it.
Again, you are using terms you clearly do not understand.
ReplyDeleteFirst, the example of the Priest making someone (not his wife) pregnant will lead to immediate dismissal as Officer in accordance with the Constitution of the OAC as well as the Household Rules.
Second, reading the Bible in a natural way will lead to confusion as the Bible contradicts itself and do not correspond with historical or scientific facts. For instance, the Bible claim the earth is about 6000 years old. Science has shown that the earth is 4.5 billion years old. There was no worldwide flood. There was no mass exodus out of Egypt.
If you at any time was as you claim a member of the OAC, you would also have known that the Biblical rules against adultery and other sins was not discarded by the OAC but observed.
The opposite of the flesh is spirit. Spirit refers to the Holy Spirit. A spirit filled person (filled with the Holy Spirit) will not give himself over to the flesh. He will be able to refrain from worldy of fleshly passions.
Again, I think you are being hypocritical, as usual.
DeleteFirst, the priest who made someone (not his wife) pregnant did NOT get dismissed as an officer irrespective of what was written on any piece of paper. That priest continued as an officer and the facts were swept under the carpet. Would you like me to share some more real life experiences and newspaper reports?
Second, reading the Bible in a “natural way” only causes confusion when you read single verses out of context. You clearly don’t care much for the Bible’s authority and I’m not surprised. I believe what’s written in the Bible and that’s good enough for me because my faith is not built on the hypothesis of a mere mortal. Blessed are they which have not seen, yet have believed (John 20:24-29). I walk by faith, not by sight (2 Corinthians 5:6-8). I don’t believe the hypothesis of a mere mortal can save souls.
Maybe the above will not be good enough for you. I’m not a scientist, neither will I pretend to be but I think the following will give you some food for thought:
DeleteThe earth is ESTIMATED to be 4.5 billion years old based on the RADIOMETRIC dating of fragments from the Canyon Diablo iron METEORITE. RADIOMETRIC ‘ages’ depend on the ASSUMPTIONS that are made and the results are only accepted if they agree with what is already BELIEVED. Scientists have NOT found a way to determine the exact age of the Earth because there is NO instrument available that directly measures age. Trees on the other hand have rings in their trunks, determining their age is as simple as counting the number of rings in their trunks. How long can a tree live before it dies of old age?
Sedimentary rocks are formed under water by deposition after transportation by water. Sedimentary rock formations, minerals and metals found in faults and folds were deformed while still soft. There is a global continuity of sedimentary formations in the geologic column with no worldwide time gap between successive “ages”. Fossils require very rapid burial and compacting in order to be preserved. Sedimentary rocks and marine fossils have been found on all the mountains of the world. Hundreds of tribes found in all parts of the world speak of a great flood in their oral traditions even before Christianity reached them.
You bluntly state that the exodus from Egypt never happened without furnishing any reasons for your statement. The most obvious reason is that you don’t believe any of the events recorded in the Bible ever literally happened. The other reason could simply be lack of archaeological evidence or faith? For the record, many major events described in various other ancient writings also have no archaeological evidence. There is no archaeological evidence of the Celt migrations in Asia Minor, Slavs into Greece or the Arameans across the Levant. There is little to no archaeological evidence of the Anglo-Saxon conquest of Britain, Arab conquest of Palestine or the Norman invasion of England. Archaeology focuses on buildings or structures and therefore if I go camping, my archaeological footprint will more than likely be invisible. Moses and his people were migrants and by definition nomadic, they were on the move. I went onto Google maps the other day to show my children two of the mining settlements I lived in as a child. To my surprise there isn’t a trace left that there ever were settlements there, all the houses, streets and roads have all been replaced by desert. And this is scarcely forty years ago! Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
The OAC do not “observe” the Biblical rules in a “natural way” as you’ve just re-affirmed in your comment. You don’t believe there was an exodus out of Egypt and therefore there’s no reason why you would literally believe that Moses received the law from God either. Your Sinai is the OAC and the spoken word of your apostle is law.
DeleteThe last part of your comment I totally agree with, but let’s face it, what you wrote and what you actually believe is based on your OAC interpretation. In reality, your interpretation of being “spirit filled” is based on a two step process. Your “angel” wings are the “word” and the “deed”, i.e. you receive the “word” from your “owergestelde” and then you go do the “deed” as told. Once you’ve earned your wings you can wear your “halo”, the “Holy Spirit” which is that comforting feeling of a clear conscience for being obedient to your “owergestelde”. You attend an OAC activity and that is deemed as not following the flesh. As long as you’re on your place and you give your “tenth” of one hour per day and interpret the Bible as an allegory you believe you are “spirit filled”. Sins of the flesh don’t matter as long as your soul is on its place because your body is “worm food” anyway. That’s the “spirit filled” experience you’re actually talking about. There are many newspaper reports about so-called “spirit filled” persons. Where there’s smoke, there’s a fire (or an OAC member puffing away on a cigarette)…
“…the Bible contradicts itself and do not correspond with historical or scientific facts…” – Sane Serenity
DeleteThen there is no reason for you to believe in spirits or souls either because there is no scientific evidence for their existence. According to science we’re just an activity of carbon and some proteins, we live and then we die. The soul is dismissed as an object of human belief or a psychological concept. We are deemed to be mere stardust ruled by the laws of chemistry and physics.
Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
DeleteExactly!
DeleteJude 10New King James Version (NKJV)
Delete10 But these speak evil of whatever they do not know; and whatever they know naturally, like brute beasts, in these things they corrupt themselves.
2 Corinthians 11:13-15 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.
DeleteFor Anonymous, This earth could be billions of years old. The bible's history can be traced back from the time Adam and Eve was outside of Paridise But they could have been in paradise for billions of years. Before they committed sin. The Bible don't says how long they were in Paradise . What we know of Paradise is in the sanctuary (paradise)where GOD placed them was no Carnivorous.
DeleteGenesis 5:5 And all the days that Adam lived were nine hundred and thirty years: and he died.
DeleteAdam was not placed as a baby in Paradise. He must have been fully-grown. Be able to talk to name the animals look and dress the garden.We know that Cain, Abel and Seth were born after they left the garden. Genesis 5:3 says "Adam was 130 years old when he fathered a son in his likeness, according to his image, and named him Seth." So maybe his years start from outside the garden.They were supposed to be forever in Paradised. Sin bring along death. aging to die. Can we say before sin there was no aging/die-ing I am just asking.
DeleteOn the sixth day man was created (Genesis 1:26-27) and more detail is given later in Genesis 2:7 on how man was formed of the dust of the ground after which the LORD God shared His breath with the man he had formed. He was formed directly from dust into a physical man and only afterwards did the LORD God breathe life into him so that he became a living soul. Only after the man had been formed and placed in the garden eastward of Eden do we see his name is Adam. That the first man was Adam is confirmed again in 1 Corinthians 15:45 and 1 Timothy 2:13-14. Adam and Jesus are the only two in the Bible who didn’t have biological fathers; Adam is called the son of God in Luke 3:38 and Jesus is called the Son of God throughout the New Testament. The serpent beguiled Eve (2 Corinthians 11:3), thus by man (Adam and Eve) came death (sin = death) into the world and by man (Jesus Christ) came the resurrection (1 Corinthians 15:21-22).
Delete@ Melt, I think you are the one ”using terms you clearly do not understand”.
DeleteFirst, the example which would supposedly ”lead to immediate dismissal as Officer in accordance with the Constitution of the OAC as well as the Household Rules”. Have you ever read any of those documents?
MAY 2009 / RESOLUTION 188, THE OLD APOSTOLIC CHURCH DOMESTIC RULES
7.6 DISCIPLINE, CLOTHING AND APPEARANCE (Also refer to paragraphs 3.11.5 and 9.5.1)
Paragraph 3.11.5 refers to Attire at picnics
7.6.1 Officers must know and adhere to the standard “Officers Code of Conduct” prescribed by the Conference of Apostles as well as any other instructions of the Apostolate or responsible Apostle regarding the conduct and discipline. In this regard members should be informed that an officer of the Church and his wife will refrain from accepting gifts or favours; and members/officers should be requested not to embarrass superior officers with gifts or favours, to spare them the need of having to refuse acceptance thereof.
Paragraph 9.5.1 refers to CLOTHING AND APPEARANCE for OFFICERS
10.4 DEVIANT SEXUAL BEHAVIOUR
10.4.1 Officers must deal with all cases of sexual divergence in their responsibilities with compassion and with the aim of achieving normalisation, where necessary with knowledgeable and/or professional assistance.
10.4.2 Through their watchfulness and observance, officers and parents can identify cases of sexual divergence in children at an early stage in order that meaningful remedial help may be rendered to and handling done for such children.
10.4.3 Officers should admonish members with sexual abnormalities not to make themselves guilty of improper conduct, not to be obtrusive, or make themselves guilty of practices that will cause them to be unacceptable to the congregation.
10.4.4 Every case of bisexuality or cases where sex changes are envisaged, must be dealt with on the merit of the specific case by the responsible Fourfold Officer in consultation with the Apostle.
Constitution of the Old Apostolic Church
DISCIPLINE
Every member and officer shall be bound by, obey and subject himself to the order, formularies, regulations. doctrine, teachings and precepts of THE CHURCH and at all times behave himself accordingly.
I guess the constitution and domestic rules above are open to interpretation very much like the confession of faith and the Bible…
DeleteYouth priest Ashley Marinus, was convicted in 2018 of inappropriately touching and making advances towards a teenage member of the church. He was only relieved of his duties as a youth priest following his conviction.
Pressure had been mounting on the church to take action against him. The church also came under fire from child rights activists for allowing Marinus to join youths on a week-long trip to Botswana while he was facing the charges.
Lucinda Evans, a child and women’s rights activist and director of the Lavender Hill non-governmental organisation Philisa Abafazi Bethu, said the church’s “protection” of Marinus was “telling of the church’s stance to protect perpetrators of sexual violence”.
“This was never a fight with the church. The church took a positional stance to not revoke his duties immediately when they heard of the charges brought against him,” Evans said.
OAC youth priest convicted of sexual assault (Oct 19, 2018)
The Old Apostolic Church of Africa (OAC) has been hauled before the Commission for the Promotion and Protection of the Rights of Cultural, Religious and Linguistic Communities (CRL Rights Commission) following allegations that the church’s white minority are using the organisation as a vehicle to enrich themselves at the expense of their majority, black members.
DeleteProbe into irregularities, enrichment of staff at OAC (Aug 26, 2020)
Questions have been raised about the church's seriousness in rooting out alleged corruption and fraud and implementing transformation within its ranks.
DeleteThe OAC made headlines after it was hauled before the Commission for the Promotion and Protection of the Rights of Cultural, Religious and Linguistic Communities (CRL Rights Commission), following allegations that its white minority were using the organisation as a vehicle to enrich themselves at the expense of their majority, black members.
An extensive complaint was submitted to the commission detailing alleged irregularities in the governance of the church, along with systemic discrimination.
Pressure on OAC to mend its ways and root out corruption (Mar 2, 2021)
To Anonymous
ReplyDeleteThis is why you people don't understand the Bible. You take 1 vers and try to explain it. And because you people don't understands it you say it mean spiritual.
Please read Jude again, or from vers 8-10
Jude (NIV)
8 In the very same way, on the strength of their dreams these ungodly people pollute their own bodies, reject authority and heap abuse on celestial beings. 9 But even the archangel Michael, when he was disputing with the devil about the body of Moses, did not himself dare to condemn him for slander but said, “The Lord rebuke you!”[d] 10 Yet these people slander whatever they do not understand, and the very things they do understand by instinct—as irrational animals do—will destroy them.
Did you see? People that use dreams and reject authority "JESUS authority" Try to read it again til you understand it. What did you try to show?
Hi,
DeleteAnonymous I just want to help if you people belief that the bible is only spiritual then you belief that moses or Abraham or any body in the ould testament whas not natural poeple also in the new testament that Jesus was not in flesh or the Apostels why do you have then Apostels in flesh
GAL 4:22) For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.
Delete23)But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise
24) Which things are an allegory: for these are two covenants; the one from mount Sinai... etc etc..
29) But he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, EVEN SO IT IS NOW.
Plus if you look to get to Abraham from Adam there would have had to have been a bunch of disgusting incest, once again maifested that Sarah was his half sister through their father Terah.
So now back to Gal 4... Abraham had one sone after the flesh and one after the Spirit.
So now *you* have a problem, because clearly the one was "in the Flesh" and the other one was Spirit. i.e one physical and spiritual.
And what's worse for you is that Jesus was out of Jacob's lineage who was of born via Sarah's spiritual baby.
Sarah (freewoman) was the wife of Abraham and Hagar was Sarah’s servant (bondwoman). God had promised Abraham many descendants (children of promise). Ten years after the promise was made, Sarah still hadn’t bore any children for Abraham and they were both on the verge of becoming too old to have children. In accordance with the custom of the day, Sarah chose to give her servant to Abraham so that he could have a child with her. Ishmael was therefore a child of the flesh, an illegitimate child born to parents who weren’t married (Genesis 16). Later Sarah bore Isaac according to God’s promise. Isaac was a child of the promise because he was born to parents who were married (Genesis 21). When God gives a promise or an instruction, it is spiritual because it’s according to His will. When we defy His will and follow our own will we are doing it according to our flesh. Ishmael and Isaac were both physical children, Isaac wasn’t a ghost or a parable.
DeleteHeeeeeeeeeeeee @ex unambithile wasuphinda ukukhipha ngomlomo ayke......
ReplyDeleteNkulunkuku abadukile ubapha mandla baduke kakhulu
@ indodana, umphimbo wabo uyiliba elivulekileyo, ngezilimi zabo bayakhohlisa, isihlungu sezinyoka siphansi kwezindebe zabo. Ngokuba amandla amahashi asemilonyeni yawo nasemisileni yawo; ngokuba imisila yawo ifana nezinyoka, inamakhanda ona ngawo.
DeleteNgokuba anginamahloni ngevangeli, ngokuba lingamandla kaNkulunkulu, kube-yinsindiso kulowo nalowo okholwayo. Ngokuba izwi lesiphambano kwababhubhayo lingubuwula, kepha kithina esisindiswayo lingamandla kaNkulunkulu. Nokukhuluma kwami nokushumayela kwami akubanga-ngamazwi okuhlakanipha ahungayo, kepha kwaba-ngesibonakaliso sikaMoya nesamandla, ukuze ukukholwa kwenu kungemi ngokuhlakanipha kwabantu, kume ngamandla kaNkulunkulu. Akube-yilowo nalowo azithobe phansi kwamandla ombuso, ngokuba akukho-mandla ombuso angaveli kuNkulunkulu, lawa akhona amiswé nguNkulunkulu. Ngakho-ke omelana namandla ombuso umelana nesimiso sikaNkulunkulu, kepha abamelana nacho bayakwamukeliswa ukulahlwa. Kuye uNkulunkulu oyedwa, uMsindisi wethu ngaye uJesu Kristu iNkosi yethu, makhube-ngukukhazimula, nobukhosi, namandla, negunya, kungakabikho izikhathi, namanje nakuze kube-phakade. Amen.
Funny that "Old Apostolic Church Revealed" would quote an atheist (Stephen Hawking) to support their arument against a spiritual interpretation, something Stephen Hawking would not dream of doing; promoting the Bible as a literal document...
ReplyDeleteRead the post again, I think you totally missed the point. One person can look at the world from a scientific and material point of view with NO spiritual significance. Another person sees the same world but with more meaning and spiritual significance. I was comparing Prof Stephen's point of view with that of Dr Tali's.
DeleteIt doesnot matter if we feel or know that our church is the only or a way to salvation from my own experience we are free to test another church like our father apostle weyitle said go look for yourself than one would know this is the only church to have the 7 hermetic principles at work go read the masterkey system to understand the glory of this church
ReplyDeleteOur church is scientificly correct if we still sceptic do one self a favour and practice or try to do "out of body experience" i promise one will see the truth that is so promised i just believe this church is jesus idea of getting there
Unfortunately you are being seriously misled and the tragic part of it is that you’re blissfully unaware of how you’re being misled. Have you ever tried reading the Bible for a change? If you did you wouldn’t be writing Jesus’ name in small letters. I don’t know if you’re aware, but Jesus’ apostles and disciples wrote the New Testament and if you took the time to read what they wrote instead of experimenting with an "out of body experience", then you would know the REAL Jesus and His ideas. The New Thought movement on the other hand is a movement which developed in the United States in the 19th century. Look around you. Look at the OAC’s culture and doctrine and you’ll see families that are broken, divorce, alcohol abuse, occultism, kids abandon the faith at the first opportunity etc... and then you claim you are in “heaven”? Is that the scientific proof of the OAC’s use of positive thinking?
DeleteHermeticism is the search for secret wisdom or knowledge. According to the Bible, wisdom is not set aside for a select few who have the masterkey to a secret system; wisdom is free to all (Proverbs 8). Read 1 Kings 3 and see how Solomon became so wise. He sacrificed to God, and God later appeared to him in a dream asking what Solomon wanted from God. Solomon asked for wisdom. Pleased, God personally answered Solomon's prayer, promising him great wisdom because he did not ask for self-serving rewards like long life or the death of his enemies. God’s wisdom is deep and unsearchable (Romans 11:33), but He is generous to give it to those who seek it from Him (James 1:5). Nowhere does the Bible say you need to go searching for wisdom by trying to have an "out of body experience".
Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world? For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe. For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom: But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness; But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God (1 Corinthians 1:20-24).
SPIRITUAL
ReplyDeleteChristians follow Jesus Christ through the Holy Spirit
Christians believe the Bible through the Holy Spirit
Christians believe Jesus is the Christ
Christians believe Jesus is the Word that took on flesh
FLESH
Apostolics follow a man claiming to have the gift of an apostle
Apostolics believe the Bible needs to be interpteted by a man claiming to have the gift of an apostle
Apostolics believe Jesus Christ is the church and that Jesus is their flesh and Christ is their gift
Apostolics believe in a word from the flesh of a man claiming to have the gift of an apostle
TOK
ReplyDelete25 Mei 2020
Huidige lering: Maar julle sal krag ontvang wanneer die Heilige Gees oor julle kom. [HAN 1:8] Toe ons as lede in die Liggaam van Christus verseël is, het ons krag ontvang om as ‘n aktiewe Apostolie te leef en om die lig vir die wêreld te wees. Hierdie krag is nie iets bonatuurlik nie. Nee, dit is die voorreg om deur die Heilige Gees gelei te word. [ROM 8:14]
Handelinge 1:8
8 maar julle sal krag ontvang wanneer die Heilige Gees oor julle kom, en julle sal my getuies wees in Jerusalem sowel as in die hele Judéa en Samaría en tot aan die uiterste van die aarde.
Romeine 8:14
14 Want almal wat deur die Gees van God gelei word, dié is kinders van God
Ek lees die TOK vanoggend die gedeelte "Die krag is nie bonatuurlike krag nie" Ek vra maar kan dit dan wees dat die Heilige Gees nie bonatuurlike krag is nie?
DeleteDie wereld glo in "bonatuurlike" dinge... Hulle verstaan nog nie dat dit veronderstel is om "GEESTELIK" te wees nie....
DeleteEk sien
DeleteSo watter tipe krag het Jesus van gepraat met Sy disciples?
Kan dit vergelyk word met Rom7 Dat die koninkryk van God bestaan in krag.
Die KRAG van God is die vereenselwing van die Woord met die Daad, waaruit die Heilige Gees (Waarheid / Vertroosting / Onderskeiding) ontslaan. Die KRAG is opgesluit in die Heilige Drie-eenheid....
DeleteEkskuus - ONTSTAAN, nie "ontslaan" nie...
DeleteEk sien
DeleteNiks is vanselfsprekend nie en ek dink net hardop... Sonder die Gees is dit ontmoontlik om God te dien? En te verstaan?
Die Heilige Gees is afkomstig van die Vader EN die Seun. Die Woord (Vader) gee geboorte aan die Daad (Seun - Christus), wat ook die Verstaanbaarheid is (Lig). Sonder die Vader EN die Seun, is daar GEEN Gees nie... Slegs wanneer al 3 teenswoordig is, kan God gedien, aanbid en verheerlik word....
DeletePresies soe watter krag bestaan hulle drie uit as te ware?
DeleteDit weet ek dit kan nie natuurlike krag wees nie
Daar is drie wat getuig in die hemel(bo) en daar is drie wat getuig op die aarde(natuurlike)
Die Gees van God (Heilige Gees / Waarheid) is ANDERS as al die ander geeste (van die mens). "Heilig" beteken afgesonderd.
DeleteElke voornaamwoord wat gebruik word in verwysing na die Gees is “hy” en nie “dit” nie. Ons word geleer om in die naam van die Vader, die Seun en die Heilige Gees te doop [MAT 28:19]. Dit is 'n kollektiewe verwysing na een Drie-enige God. Ons moet ook nie die Heilige Gees bedroef nie [EFE 4:30]. Die Gees kan teen gesondig word [JES 63:10] en vir hom gelieg word [HAN 5:3]. Ons moet Hom gehoorsaam [HAN 10:19-21] en Hom eer [PSA 51:13].
DeleteDie persoonlikheid van die Heilige Gees word ook bevestig deur sy vele werke. Hy was persoonlik betrokke by die skepping [GEN 1:2], bemagtig God se volk [SAG 4:6], lei [ROM 8:14], troos [JOH 14:26], veroordeel [JOH 16:8], leer [JOH 16:13] en gee opdragte [HAN 8:29]. Elkeen van hierdie werke vereis die betrokkenheid van 'n persoon eerder as 'n blote krag, ding of idee.
Die Heilige Gees het lewe [ROM 8:2], het 'n wil [1 KOR 12:11], is alwetend [1 KOR 2:10-11], is ewig [HEB 9:14] en is alomteenwoordig [PSA 139:7]. 'n Blote krag kon nie al hierdie eienskappe besit nie, maar wel die Heilige Gees.
Die persoonlikheid van die Heilige Gees word bevestig deur sy rol as die derde Persoon van die Godheid. Slegs 'n wese wat aan God gelyk is [MAT 28:19] en die eienskappe van alwetendheid, alomteenwoordigheid en ewigheid besit, kan gedefinieer word as God.
Petrus verwys na die Heilige Gees as God [HAN 5:3-4] en Paulus verwys ook na die Heilige Gees as God [2 KOR 3:17-18]. Die Heilige Gees is 'n persoon, soos die Skrif dit duidelik maak. As sodanig moet Hy eerbiedig word as God en dien hy in perfekte eenheid met Vader en Seun om ons in ons geestelike lewens te lei.
Lyk my volgens die TOK hou die OAK vas aan 'n filosofie genaamd “naturalisme”, wat glo dat alles die resultaat is van suiwer natuurlike prosesse. Diegene wat aan die filosofie van “naturalisme” vashou, gaan verder as om natuurlike oorsake vir sekere gebeure te erken; hulle sluit God en die bonatuurlike per definisie uit. Bonatuurlike oorsake word as onmoontlik verwerp.
Aan die ander kant glo Christene in die moontlikheid van bonatuurlike ingryping - dit wil sê dat daar meer aan die wêreld is as wat in die natuur voorkom of wat deur die wetenskappe waargeneem en bewys kan word. God, engele, bose geeste en die menslike gees is almal deel van die bonatuurlike wêreld; daarom is wonderwerke moontlik. Vir iemand wat aan die filosofie van “naturalisme” vashou, word 'n wonderwerk uiteraard uitgesluit. Vir Christene daarenteen, is 'n wonderwerk 'n lewensvatbare verklaring vir 'n onverklaarbare gebeurtenis.
Die bonatuurlike is bo en behalwe die natuurwette (soos die opstanding van Jesus). 'n Wonderwerk is altyd bonatuurlik. 'n Wonderwerk is 'n gebeurtenis waarin God ingryp en die “wette van die natuur” ignoreer om iets te doen wat nooit “natuurlik” sou kon gebeur het nie. Dit beteken egter nie dat 'n wonderwerk nie deur wetenskaplike ondersoek bevestig kan word nie. Na Jesus se opstanding ('n bonatuurlike gebeurtenis), het hy Thomas uitgenooi om die resultate op natuurlike maniere te verifieer - om die wonde wat nog sigbaar was, te ondersoek [JOH 20:24-29].
WAAROM ONS DIE BYBEL GEESTELIK VERTOLK.
ReplyDeleteDie OU TESTEMENT bevat die geskiedenis van Israel van ouds. Hulle was die enigste Volk wat God aanbid het en het hulle self beskou as die uitverkore Volk van God.
Die NUWE TESTEMENT is ook 'n beskrywing van die mense en gebeurtenisse vanaf die koms van die Messias, Jesus Christus, wat 'n nuwe weg tot saligheid daargestel het, waardeur die Saligheid uitgebrei word tot die hele mensdom.
Die gebeurtenisse is in die natuurlike taal van mense geskryf. 'n Mens wat dit lees se gedagtes gaan na die verlede en onwillekeurig vorm hy gedagtebeelde van mense en gebeurtenisse volgens sy eie vertolking, wat maklik kan verskil van die wil en weë van God.
Die enigste manier om vas te stel of hierdie vertolking korrek is, is om die bewyse in die Bybel te soek.
SKRIFTURE
1 Kor 15:44
1 Kor 15:46
1 Kor 15:40
1 Kor 15:47
Joh 6:63
Rom 2:29
Rom 8:13
2 Kor 4:16
Gal 3:3
Gal 5:16
Spr 16:32
Job 37:24
Job 11:11
Gal 6:8
VERDUIDELIKING
DIE NATUURLIKE MENS
Word ook genoem die vleeslike of aardse mens.
Hier vind ons bewyse van die bestaan van die natuurlike en geestelike mens asook die basiese verskille tussen hulle.
Die natuurlike mens het eerste bestaan en het natuurlike behoeftes (want hy is uit die aarde aards) naamlik voedsel, kleding en beskerming, daarom het hy neigings om terwille van oorlewing homself altyd eerste wil bevoordeel teenoor ander. Hy soek na status, eer en eie gemak en as gevolg hiervan openbaar hy eienskappe soos beskryf word in Gal 5:19 “owerspel, hoerery, onreinheid, ongebondenheid; 20 afgodery, towery, vyandskap, twis, jaloersheid, toornigheid, naywer, tweedrag, partyskap; 21 afguns, moord, dronkenskap, brassery en dergelike dinge...” hy lê nie sy lewe af vir sy vriend nie.
Die natuurlike mens se lewensbestek op aarde is tydelik van aard. In Gen 3:19 lees ons dat die natuurlike liggaam stof is en sal terug keer tot stof want 1 Kor 15:50 sê dat vlees en bloed die koningkryk van GOD nie sal beêrwe nie.
Die gees van die natuurlike mens wat in hom is vanaf geboorte het saam met hom gegroei en ontwikkel aangaande aardse aangeleenthede.
Hierdie natuurlike gedagtegang van die mens is die oorsaak dat die mens die Bybel en die Godheid op ‘n natuurlike wyse verstaan en bely.
Snaaks dat nie een van u “SKRIFTURE” verwys na vertolking van die Bybel nie. Wat my ook opgeval het was dat u net na enkele versies verwys sonder om die volle konteks en betekenis daarvan in ag te neem, byvoorbeeld 1 Kor 15:44, 1 Kor 15:46 ens. ipv 1 Kor 15:35-58.
DeleteHet u geweet dat die Bybel reeds ‘n geestelike boek is? As u die hele Bybel begin lees en aanvaar as die Woord van God sonder om die Skrif te verdraai, weg te neem of by te voeg nie (Deuteronomium 4:2, Deuteronomium 12:32, Spreuke 30:5-6, Openbaring 22:18-21), sal u met behulp van die Heilige Gees geestelik begin groei en verander.
2 Timotheus 3:16-17
Die hele Skrif is deur God ingegee en is nuttig tot lering, tot weerlegging, tot teregwysing, tot onderwysing in die geregtigheid, sodat die mens van God volkome kan wees, vir elke goeie werk volkome toegerus.
Dis vleeslike begeertes wat stryd voer teen die siel, nie “gedagtebeelde van mense en gebeurtenisse” volgens Bybel vertolking nie (1 Petrus 2:11-12).
Net gou ‘n paar vragies mbt u stelling: “…Hierdie natuurlike gedagtegang van die mens is die oorsaak dat die mens die Bybel en die Godheid op ‘n natuurlike wyse verstaan en bely…”
2 Konings 12:9 – is die kissie vir die tiendes met ‘n gaatjie in die deksel voor in die OAK se saal natuurlik of geestelik?
Maleagi 3:10 – gooi OAK lede natuurlike tiendes of geestelike tiendes in bogenoemde kissie?
1 Korinthiërs 11:5-6 – bedek die natuurlike vrouens hul natuurlike hoofde met natuurlike hoedens tydens OAK byeenkomste of is dit alles geestelik?
1 Korinthiërs 14:34 – is dit natuurlike vroue wat in die OAK nie mag preek nie of geestelike vroue?
1 Timotheus 3:2 – om ‘n amp te beklee in die OAK, moet ‘n natuurlike man met ‘n natuurlike vrou natuurlik getroud wees of kan hulle geslag en huwelik geestelik wees?
DIE WERKE VAN DIE NATUURLIKE MENS
ReplyDeleteOm die verskil tussen die natuurlike en geestelike mens beter te verstaan is dit nodig om na die eienskappe en optredes van die natuurlike mens te kyk.
SKRIFTURE
Gal 5:17
Gal 6:8
Gal 5:19
1 Joh 2:15-17
VERDUIDELIKING
In Joh 4:24 sien ons "God is Gees en die wat Hom aanbid moet Hom in Gees en Waarheid aanbid."
Inteenstelling hiermee is die natuurlike mens se lewe gekonsenteer om aardse rykdomme te vergader. In sy wedloop om dit te verkry is sy optredes vleeslik van aard soos geskrywe is in Gal 5:19 en dit is vyandskap teen God want dit onderwerp hom nie aan die wet van God nie.
In Rom 8:14 lees ons "almal wat deur die Gees van God gelei word, dié is kinders van God".
Die natuurlike mens laat die begeertes van die vlees en oë voorkeur geniet in sy lewe bo die wil van God.
Ek hou van u stelling mbt vleeslike optredes, ”…dit is vyandskap teen God want dit onderwerp hom nie aan die wet van God nie…”.
DeleteKom ons lees nou daai hele gedeelte om die volle betekenis daarvan te verstaan.
Galasiërs 5:16-26
Maar ek sê:
Wandel deur die Gees, dan sal julle nooit die begeerlikheid van die vlees volbring nie;
want die vlees begeer teen die Gees, en die Gees teen die vlees;
en hulle staan teenoor mekaar,
sodat julle nie kan doen wat julle wil nie.
Maar as julle deur die Gees gelei word, dan is julle nie onder die wet nie.
En die werke van die vlees is openbaar, naamlik
owerspel, hoerery, onreinheid, ongebondenheid;
afgodery, towery, vyandskap, twis, jaloersheid, toornigheid, naywer, tweedrag, partyskap;
afguns, moord, dronkenskap, brassery en dergelike dinge,
waarvan ek julle vooraf sê, soos ek al vroeër gesê het,
dat die wat sulke dinge doen, die koninkryk van God nie sal beërwe nie.
Maar die vrug van die Gees is
liefde,
blydskap,
vrede,
lankmoedigheid,
vriendelikheid,
goedheid,
getrouheid,
sagmoedigheid,
selfbeheersing.
Teen sulke dinge is die wet nie.
Maar die wat aan Christus behoort, het die vlees met sy hartstogte en begeerlikhede gekruisig.
As ons deur die Gees lewe, laat ons ook deur die Gees wandel. Laat ons nie word soekers van ydele eer wat mekaar uittart en mekaar beny nie.
Het u nou daai verse mooi deurgelees? Daar is geen manier om dit anders te vertolk nie, dit is baie duidelik uiteengesit. Iemand wat dus die begeerlikheid van die vlees volbring, wandel nie deur die Gees nie.
Om Bybel te lees kan beslis nie as begeerlikheid van die vlees beskou word nie.
Om wetteloos op te tree kan wel as begeerlikheid van die vlees beskou word.
Dit alles kom neer op sonde.
Wat is sonde?
Om die wette van God doelbewus te verontagsaam.
DIE NATUURLIKE MENS SE VERTOLKING VAN DIE BYBEL
ReplyDeleteINLEIDING
Omdat die natuurlike mens se optredes vleeslik van aard is soek hy regverdiging vir sy dade.
Die maklikste manier om dit te verkry is om die Bybel (die Woord van God soos hy dit noem) so te vertolk dat dit nie beskuldig of aankla nie.
SKRIFTURE
1 Kor 2:14
Rom 8:5 – 7
Jud 1:10
Joh 3:31
1 Kor 1:19
VERDUIDELIKING
Die natuurlike mens se vertolking van die Bybel is natuurlik van aard en daarom kan hy dit nie verstaan soos God dit gegee het nie.
In Matt 13:10 sien ons Jesus se dissipels vra Hom hoekom spreek Hy tot die skare deur gelykenisse? Hy antwoord hulle “dit is aan julle gegee om die verborgenhede van die koningkryk van God te ken, maar aan hulle is dit nie gegee nie.”
Dit bewys hoekom die natuurlike mens die geestelike vertolking van die Apostel belaster en verwerp.
Nou is u heeltemal die klits kwyt! Waar het u al ooit gesien dat ‘n moordenaar of dief of verkragter ”… die Bybel (die Woord van God soos hy dit noem)…” kan vertolk dat dit nie beskuldig of aankla nie? Die Bybel is vlak genoeg dat ‘n kind dit kan verstaan, tog diep genoeg dat ‘n geleerde daarin kan verdrink.
DeleteRakende u stelling; ”…Dit bewys hoekom die natuurlike mens die geestelike vertolking van die Apostel belaster en verwerp…”
Ek neem aan u verwys na die OAK se apostels?
Apostles of today
Ek glo nie die OAK se apostels lees die Bybel noukeurig genoeg nie, ek dink hulle vertrou meer op hul eie verbeeldings. Hoekom dink ek so? Gaan kyk bietjie op YouTube waar DRIE OAK apostels die begrafnisdiens van een van hul profete waargeneem het.
OAK apostel Van Tonder by 38:37 “…but I have to trouble the waters again, I have to remind them, and when I trouble the water, the angel of the Lord will descend into that bath of Bethesda. This is the mind of understanding, but the angel must first trouble the water before there can come healing…”
Gaan lees bietjie Johannes 5:1-17 en doen ‘n vergelyking.
OAK apostel Van Tonder by 40:25 “…thy rod and thy staff will comfort me. How will it comfort me? What is the rod, what is the staff? Yes, the shepherd of the Lord is the rod and the staff. The shepherd of the Lord, the one that comes to remind me, day after day as the prophet Cole did…”
Gaan lees bietjie Psalms 23:1-6 en doen ‘n vergelyking.
Hierdie is maar net ‘n paar voorbeelde, daar is verder uitgebrei oor hierdie spesifieke video in die kommentare by:
Prophecies, dreams and visions
Enige Gees vervulde persoon sal die valse leer van die OAK se valse apostels verwerp (2 Korinthiërs 11:13-15).
AAN WIE IS DIT GEGEE OM DIE SKRIFTE TE VERSTAAN
ReplyDeleteINLEIDING
Noudat ons gesien het dat die natuurlike mens se vertolking van die Bybel natuurlik van aard is en dat dit God nie behaag nie, moet ons uit die skrifte kan bewys aan wie God dit gegee het om die skrifte te verstaan.
SKRIFTURE
Joh 4:24
Matt 13:11
Luk 24:45
Luk 6:13
1 Kor 2:13
Joh 14:17
2 Kor 3:5-6
1 Kor 2:7
1 Joh 5:20
1 Tess 2:13
Mark 4:11
VERDUIDELIKING
Uit bogenoemde tekse sien ons dat Christus Sy Apostels se verstand geopen het om die skrifte te verstaan want aan hulle alleen is dit gegee om die verborgenhede van die koninkryk van die hemele te ken, soos opgeteken in 1 Kor 4:1 “so moet ons dan beskou word as die dienaars van Christus en bedienaars van die verborgenhede van God”.
Die Apostels se bekwaamheid is uit God want in Hand 4:13 lees ons “dat hulle natuurlik van aard ongeleerd en eenvoudige manne was”. Hulle is deur die Gees geleer om geestelike dinge (verwysend na die skrifte) met geestelike te vergelyk.
In Matt 28:20 sê Jesus aan sy Apostels “dat Hy saam met hulle sal bly tot aan die voleinding van die wêreld”. Die wêreld se einde het nog nie aangebreek nie, dus bly die belofte van toepassing.
In Heb 3:1 lees ons: "Daarom, heilige broeders, deelgenote van die hemelse roeping let op die Apostel en Hoëpriester van ons belydenis, Christus Jesus". Hier is dit baie duidelik dat Christus ook die Apostel en Hoëpriester is. Wanneer ons verwys na die Apostel, verwys ons na Christus; en as ons na die Hoëpriester verwys, verwys ons weer na Christus of die hoëpriester of anders om. Die Apostel van vandag sê; "Ek is nie die Apostel nie, maar slegs 'n dienskneg van die Groot Apostel Christus Jesus, wat al die Ou Apostoliese Kerk se lede uitmaak". Wanneer daar na die Apostel verwys word, word daar na Christus verwys. Christus op Sy beurt is al die lede van die Kerk wat die werke van God openbaar. Hierdie lede word dus deur God bekwaam gemaak en het die gawe ontvang om die skrifte te verstaan.
Het u geweet dat geen enkele OAK apostel ooit teenwoordig was toe Jesus met Sy eie apostels gepraat het nie? Die OAK is een van die jongste kerke ter wêreld tenspyte van hul misleidende naam. Die Nuwe Testament het nog baie lank voor 1927 al bestaan.
DeleteOAC origin and history
Mattheus 10:1-4
En Hy het sy twaalf dissipels na Hom geroep en aan hulle mag gegee oor onreine geeste, om hulle uit te dryf en om elke siekte en elke kwaal te genees.
En dit is die name van die twaalf apostels:
die eerste Simon wat Petrus genoem word,
en Andréas, sy broer;
Jakobus, die seun van Sebedéüs,
en Johannes, sy broer;
Filippus
en Bartholoméüs;
Thomas
en Matthéüs, die tollenaar;
Jakobus, die seun van Alféüs,
en Lebbéüs wat genoem word Thaddéüs;
Simon Kananítes
en Judas Iskáriot, die een wat Hom verraai het.
Het u dalk enige van u se apostels se name hierbo raakgelees?
Are there still Apostles today?
Die “Apostel van vandag” waarna u verwys as iemand wat sê; "Ek is nie die Apostel nie, maar slegs 'n dienskneg van die Groot Apostel Christus Jesus, wat al die Ou Apostoliese Kerk se lede uitmaak" is ‘n valse apostel, daar is net EEN Jesus en Hy alleen is die Apostel en Hoëpriester, niemand anders nie!
Who is Jesus?
Then opened He their understanding
Mattheus 24:23-27
As iemand dán vir julle sê:
Kyk, hier is die Christus!
of: Daar! —moet dit nie glo nie.
Want daar sal valse christusse en valse profete opstaan, en hulle sal groot tekens en wonders doen om, as dit moontlik was, ook die uitverkorenes te mislei.
Kyk, Ek het dit vir julle vooruit gesê.
As hulle dan vir julle sê:
Kyk, Hy is in die woestyn—moenie uitgaan nie;
kyk, Hy is in die binnekamer—moet dit nie glo nie.
Want soos die weerlig uit die ooste uitslaan en tot in die weste skyn, so sal ook die koms van die Seun van die mens wees.
From before the time of Yeshua (Jesus), Jewish students have studied the Scriptures as well as the oral laws and traditions in a structured way developed by the Pharisees. (The Pharisees emerged into what we would call today, Orthodox Jews.)
ReplyDeleteThe four-step interpretation method that developed from the Pharisee teaching is known as PaRDeS (garden or orchard).
Each step is considered deeper than the last:
Peshat—meaning simple—the plain, straight, literal meaning of the text. This is considered the keystone to understanding Scripture.
Remez—meaning hint—the symbolic or allegorical consideration that hints at the depth of the text.
Deresh—meaning concept, from the Hebrew darah (inquire/seek)—a look at comparative or metaphorical meaning.
Sod—meaning hidden—the secrets of the text or hidden meanings.
While this method of interpretation over the centuries has led to the development of allegory (metaphorical stories) and mystical types of interpretation, it can give us a framework for examining the historical, cultural, and linguistic aspects of Scripture.
For example, in the Brit Chadashah (New Testament), which was written in the Greek language, we read that the Apostle Peter had a vision of unclean animals, reptiles, and birds. They appeared on a sheet that came down from heaven; then God told Peter to “kill and eat” them. (Acts 10:9-13)
The simple (peshat) meaning appears to be that God told Peter he should now eat non-kosher (unclean) animals.
But we must look deeper into comparable Scriptures and the concepts at hand in this account.
When Peter responded to God: “I have never eaten anything impure or unclean. ”God responded back: “Do not call anything impure that God has made clean.” (Acts 10:14-15)
Most Christians are told that God was speaking here about the unclean animals. But a closer look at what happened before and after Peter’s vision helps us understand what God was teaching Peter.
Scripture tells us that at about the same time Peter had his vision of the unclean animals, a Gentile Roman Centurion named Cornelius was visited by an angel of God who told him that he should tell his servants to find Peter and invite him to his home. (Acts 10:1-8)
Because of a Jewish concept (deresh) at the time, Jews believed that Gentiles, such as Cornelius and his household were “unclean” and no self-respecting Jew would enter his home.
At the same time that the men arrived at the home where Peter was staying in Joppa, the Spirit of God spoke to him telling him to go with the men.
Under any other circumstance, Peter would have rejected an invitation from this “unclean” Gentile.
But this time, Peter travelled to Cornelius’ home and invited him and his whole household to accept Yeshua (Jesus) as their Savior; and the Holy Spirit came on all who heard the message. (Acts 10:44-48)
In this example, by understanding the Jewish culture and laws of the Torah, we are able to go beyond the simple (peshat) meaning, go deeper into new concepts (deresh), and uncover the hidden (sod) meaning of God’s Word.
We can also uncover possible hidden meanings by looking at Scripture in its original language whether Hebrew in the Tanakh (Old Testament) or Greek (New Testament), as well as Jewish customs about the text.
ReplyDeleteIn Numbers 29:12–40, God details the libations (liquid offerings) that are to be made on each of the eight days of the feast of Sukkot (Tabernacles).
Generally, when a libation is prescribed in the Torah, the type of liquid is identified, whether it is wine, oil, or water. However, God does not specify what type of libation is to be used during Sukkot.
However, there are clues in the spelling or misspelling of three words that help us identify what kind of liquid God wants us to use for a libation offering during Sukkot.
Looking at Numbers 29 verse 19, the word for libation offering has an additional letter at the end of the word: (m) mem — וְנִסְכֵּיהֶם, which makes it plural. According to the 12th century commentator Rashi, this mem hints at something more, as we’ll see next.
In verse 31 there is the additional letter: (y) yud, which doesn’t belong in the word for libation offering — וּנְסָכֶיהָ.
And in verse 33, there is an additional (m) mem, which doesn’t belong in the word prescribed — כְּמִשְׁפָּטָם.
These three letters spell m-y-m (pronounced mayim in Hebrew), which means water.
And that’s what had been taking place during Sukkot in ancient Israel – the Water Libation (Pouring) Ceremony!
These are examples of the hidden (sod) things in the Torah, and God wants to reveal them to us but we need to search for them.
The beginning in Genesis explained.
ReplyDeleteGENESIS & JOHN_ Is Genesis Real History? Sam Shamoun: